Captain's Quarters -

Don't underestimate the significance of German shame and guilt over the Holocaust. Shame evokes anger,and when one is shamed, the tendency is to either turn it inwards or reject it and turn it outward. In the first case, internalized shame/anger causes depression and despair; when projected it becomes an opportunity to discharge the unpleasure of anger and shame by attacking the imagined source of the pain. ("You made me feel bad, so I will blame and attack you.") For Germans, and the Europeans complicit in the Holocaust, imagining the Jew as the new Nazi rationalizes their past hate and perpetuates their present hate (often disguised as intellectualized anti-Zionism.) Americans, since Nuremberg, are not only the embodiment of the morality forced upon the German state, but have also now become conflated with Jews (and are considered the only thing keeping the world from dealing with the "evil" of the state of Israel); thus we are included in the German animus.
Thus, it is not only safe to attack Americans (and Jews), but it discharges unpleasant feelings and gratifies the need to disown their own past and present hatreds.
As has been said, the Germans have never forgiven the Jews for the Holocaust.

Cap'n Ed wrote:

Perhaps the Germans would get a better appreciation for security issues if they shouldered more of the burden for them. It's time to close down the relics of the Cold War in Germany, and locate our military forces in nations more amenable to America. Poland would probably have some interest in hosting American bases, and they would have more strategic location in this era than Germany. Let the Germans have their space from the warmongering Americans and pay for their own national security. We do not need to stay where we are not wanted or appreciated.

This is often discussed, and I can't figure out why we don't do it. I know that the German left kinda-sorta doesn't want us to leave, as many of their union members have cushy jobs on US bases or otherwise make a living catering to GIs stationed in the country.

O' course, if we DID withdraw our troops from Germany and most of the other EU countries where they are stationed, I'm sure we'd catch hell from the usual suspects for our "unilateralism" and for "turning our backs on our European allies". And, o' course, the instant that the Euros get into any sort of a tiff (for example, a group of angry Girl Scouts attacked Belgium), they'd be screaming about our NATO obligations and how it's the clear duty of the United States to bail them out... Again.

Germans.... their marriage rate is rock bottom, they sustain their self-indulgent lifesyle by importing slavery while their females are so narcissistic that they are now dumping their babies in the garbage.

By any menas necessary we must get away from that hellhole.

It's Safer To Hate Us

Now, hate is way too strong a term.

Germans want things to remain just as they are, and resent anybody who is rocking the boat. Stupidly enough, a lot of of us are ready to ignore what Iran is doing so that they can keep on thinking that way.

Even so, a poll is just a poll. Depending on who is asking, a majority of German respondents are either for or against military action again.

I hope when (not if) things go sour in Europe, that we sit back with our arms folded, and say "You hate us so much? Now you have CAUSE to hate us. YOU made your bed, no sleep in it, you ungrateful bastards!"

Captain,

You can be fairly sure that a re-deployment from Germany is going to happen. This will be gradual since we have spent over 50 years creating an American military infrastructure there. It will take time to re-create that in places like Poland. But it will happen and “good Germans” will not be able to stop it.

But you can also be sure that during that time neither Germany nor the rest of that exhausted, aging and moribund continent will prepare itself for defense. “Defense against who?” will be the question as sharia law gradually becomes a fact. It will be interesting to watch today’s hip young German frauleins adapt to headscarves.

Shrinkwrapped:

Let's cut through the psycho-babble. The German's hate us because we crushed them in two World Wars. As the Cold War has recedes from living memory that old anger about losing twice to the Americans reasserts itself. They blame us for Hitler because we defeated the Kaiser. They blame us for beating Hitler because we destroyed Germany in the process. They blame the Jews because once an idea enters a culture it becomes part of that culture.

Sometimes in the dark of the night , when I'm in my cups, I sometimes wish we would act as evily as the world claims that we do for a bit, just so they'd quit their kvetching about how we act now. The old routine of being hung for a sheep instead of a lamb. You have to admit, it works. We bend over backwards to help them, and they spit in our face. The Iranians make threats and thumb their noses at them, and everyone wants to make accomodations with the Mullahs. Machiavelli was right. Much better to be feared than loved.

Actually, it might be better if we just crash terraformed Mars, moved there, & brought Israel with us. Let the rest of the world join us once they get their act together enough to make it to the Up And Out. If they make it, great. If not, then it sucks to be them.

Who would you consider to be more dangerous? Iraq, Iran or Afganistan don't have the inclination or resources to travel halfway around the world and completely destroy countries that have done them no harm.

9/11 was planned, funded and perpetrated by terrorists from the Gulf States. Radical Islamic Jihad is preached around the World by Wahaby clerics, from the Gulf States. Bush failed to see the real threat and took us to war against the wrong people.

The Germans would not have made that mistake!

I'm reading a terrific book - http://www.amazon.com/While-Europe-Slept-Radical-Destroying/dp/0385514727/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-2532309-3602403?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1175171843&sr=1-1 - that spends a lot of time on anti-Americanism.

It's goes back to the Cold War, and has always been a "safe" conversational gambit, not just in Germany but throughout Western Europe.

This book is weil-worth reading.

Assuming the accuracy of the poll, these results suggest projection on the part of the German people. Germany was the "catalyst"
for the two most horrific wars in human history and "perfected" state sponsored genocide. The Germans have a hard time acknowledging the sins of their recent past and are psychologically stunted elitists.

The matter of US bases on "old Europe" is a simple one. If those countries don't believe there is a security problem, then there's no need for us to spend billions each year maintaining about 80,000 US military personnel there. If they do believe there is a security problem, it's their responsibility to address it. Let them spend the billions necessary to provide for their own security. If they're unwilling to do so, it doesn't make it our problem. We've carried those ingrates long enough.

shrinkwrapped and jerry:

If there is Anti-Americanism or not, Germans don't blame the Jews for anything, and Germany is Israel most important and closest besides the US:

isn't it interesting that a lot of us don't think much of the Germans either? Contracts to build Palaces and a cozy relationship with Saddam by the Germans certainly soured me on them. Of course, it was in their immediate national best interests to save those millions of oil saturated dollars they got as a reward for opposing the sanctions regime.

Don't the liberals know that the Europeans are smart enough to figure out that the "Bush lied, people died" mantra which won them the last election points back at what the previous Clinton Administration did too? American foriegn policy concerning what Iraq was about did not significantly change when Bush took office.

A significant number of Americans believe what the Germans believe, which influences the German belief. We just have to live with it for the rest of our lives.

Many of the previous comments are interesting and mostly thoughtful. I tend to agree most with Larry J and The Friendly Grizzly except I don't agree with the middle sentence, "Now you have CAUSE to hate us." They have no cause for hating us for ceasing to do what they should have been doing and which they didn't want us to do.

We should have been out of Europe not just Germany fifteen years ago. It's not at all clear to me that NATO serves our interests anymore either.

I tend to be an originalist in policy as well as judiciary.
Washington, "steer clear of permanent alliances".
Jefferson, "no entangling alliances".

reddog,

You are a fool if you think the war against Islamofascism can be won solely by military means.

It is a war of ideas. It is Wahhabist Islam versus the idea that men can govern themselves.

Supporting a democracy in the mideast is a direct threat to the ideology of Wahhabism. The jihadis know this, and you are a fool to ignore them in your calculations of how this war should be fought.

US has what, 70,000 troops stationed in Germany, yet Germans feel safe enough to hate us, and even take the lead in imposing the war against Saddam. As an evil empire the US is sure going about it badly.

Oh, and whenever we do consider moving some troops out of Germany to other countries, somehow we are just being crybabies, and we should leave the troops there because the local people love them (well, at least the dollars we spend there.)

i think we have taken all the fight out of the Germans; now is that necessarily a good thing or a bad thing?

Occasionally reading the German papers online makes me regret my six years of service in USAREUR. I froze my ass off near the inner German border for this? We should have let Germany rot after WWII. I'm sure many Germans - the leftists who oppose us so vehemently now - would have found life in a communist police state quite amenable.

The lesson is pretty clear to me, and it's a 180 from what I've believed all my life. But in the future the U.S. should only ever act in direct national self interest. Screw human rights causes abroad, liberty and all that stuff. We got ours. Not one more penny for the defense of ingrates. Germany and France and Belgium want to have the privilege to talk like grownups and to stand in grownup podiums and be treated as grownups, but don't want to be saddled with the duties that grownup countries have to execute. For chrissakes, even Russia and China understand this... Most of Olde Europe needs to sit at the kids' table for a while until they can act like adults. Petulance is ugly in individuals, it is downright embarassing when nations indulge in it.

Shrinkwrapped, jerry, cahmd55:
You give some reasons, psychological and otherwise, for why Germany thinks that the US is a greater threat to peace than Iran. This view, however, is also shared by the rest of the world. For example, the EU as a whole sees the US tied with Iran and North Korea for second place (behind Israel) as the biggest threat to world peace:

http://www.angus-reid.com/polls/index.cfm/fuseaction/viewItem/itemID/1142

So what are the reasons for Spain, Austria, Denmark, Belgium, the UK, Finland, France, Greece, Ireland, Italy, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Portugal, and Sweden seeing the US as a threat to global peace equal to Iran? Does it all have to do with WWII and Hitler?

People here say that because of the public opinion in Germany against the US, the US should remove its troops from that country. I agree. I think the public should decide in all countries on whether or not they want the US military in their nations. If so, the US would have to shut down 99% of its 800 or so bases around the world.

Moneyrunner:
“…as sharia law gradually becomes a fact. It will be interesting to watch today’s hip young German frauleins adapt to headscarves.”

I work with someone from Iran, and she has shown me pictures of women in Iran. The scarves they wear are simply that – scarves draped over their heads. They are certainly not burkas. You can see a couple examples in this slideshow (the show also has some scenic pictures of Iran – you can see what it looks like there before the US and/or Israel nukes it):

http://www.lucasgray.com/video/peacetrain.html

The women in Iran keep up with all the latest trends and colors in Europe, and many wear their montos (wraps) skin tight, and they leave little to the imagination. Many of the Iranian women I’ve seen look much sexier in these tight wraps than the fat-ass American women I see walking around where I live.

Cybrludite:
“Actually, it might be better if we just crash terraformed Mars, moved there, & brought Israel with us.”

Best idea I ever heard.

We see these polls often, from every country around the world. I think possibly it has more to do with the perception of American power (and a belief that we will use it). Our power compared to any other country in the world is overwhelming.

I also think that the people who respond to these polls are defining world peace as an absence of military activity, a maintenance of the status quo; however inharmonious or oppressive it might be, it constitutes peace as long as American tanks aren't rolling in the streets.

America cannot be counted on to maintain the status quo, we have this disturbing tendency to shake things up, and as we have shown in the last 10 years we are prepared to use military power to do it. Iran would as well, she just doesn't have the arsenal to do it at our level. And of course her motives would be different.

"So what are the reasons for Spain, Austria, Denmark, Belgium, the UK, Finland, France, Greece, Ireland, Italy, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Portugal, and Sweden seeing the US as a threat to global peace equal to Iran? Does it all have to do with WWII and Hitler?"
Dave,

This year the US is celebrating the 400th anniversary of Jamestown, one of the first colonies in (what would become) the US. In those 400 years we have gone from a raw wilderness to the largest economy, most powerful military, the first constitutional republic that enshrined natural rights, and the only country to put a man on the moon. The rest of the world hates us because they are jealous.

From what I have read, the German media has done its best to accent the worse in the US and leave out the good; therefore they picture we are now under the Bush dictatorship with our freedoms suppressed. They have attempted to create a caricature of the US at least since the Reagan administration. When I was there in the early 1970’s I encountered no anti-Americanism; just the opposite. Actually when I spent a month in 1999 in Germany I didn’t notice any overt anti-Americanism. But their MSM is to the left of ours, if that can be imagined. The German media have used this to influence the people against us, especially since Mr. Bush has taken office. And their past governments have aided in that effort.

Since we are not permitted to kick a@@ and take names by the world community and our suicidal PC BDS inclined elite, maybe it is time after over 60 years of American occupation of Germany to remove our occupying forces and allow them total self- government. Maybe we should consider doing that also in Japan and South Korea. We could redeploy to New Orleans to help that economy instead and be available for rapid deployment to Europe, Japan or Korea, if needed. That is not too far away, just as Okinawa is close to Iraq as our esteemed military genius Representative Murtha informed us recently. But seriously, keeping 70,000 or so troops in Germany and however many we have in other European countries is a little ridiculous with the war against Islamicfascist ongoing and the cold war over (unless Putin is rekindling it). Could this be why our efforts in Iraq are being portrayed as stretching our military too thin.

As one commentator indicated, it is a shame that we can’t use the tactics that are used against us. We are being accused of that by the world press and NGOs anyway, I would submit. These are the very same ones that have been silent about Iran’s violation of the Geneva Accords with the treatment of the 15 Brits they have kidnapped, ah captured. Actually we could use much more aggressive tactics, but are not willing to expose ourselves to criticism or infect our political system and military with that virus. However, in the Pacific during WWII we fought with ROE that was criminal by the elite’s present moral standards for warfare. And that was by the “Greatest Generation”. The major wars since WWII; Korea, Vietnam, Iraq I and now Iraq II have been fought without utilizing our full military power and none were victories in the conventional sense. Heck, we still have troops in former Yugoslavia more than 10 years after they were promised to be withdrawn. It is time that we relearned how to defeat an enemy, using the old definition of defeat.

The move out of germany has been in the works for a long time now and it can’t happen fast enough. Wonder how the business's in K-town will feel when their customer base is gone? And dave, as an American I think the pacifist bent of all the nations you list is more a threat to world peace than the US could ever be and history supports my assertion. You on the other hand are talking out your ass. I could care less what the rest of the world thinks. Your all hypocrites and cowards. Can you say sharia, dave? I think you can.

Bostonian,

I'm actually quite worried about the point you made concerning democracy.

We have installed a democratic government in Iraq (just as we did in Germany so many years ago). In essence, we used military means to effect regime change there. Could that be why the Saudi king appears to be shaking in his boots at the Arab summit? The words he used about us are not the words one friend uses to describe another. One begins to wonder if the Sunnis in Iraq are receiving some over-the-border aid.

It's obvious that our actions in Iraq have unnerved the Saudis considerably. They understand that their house is dirty too.

With regard to the docjim's position on US troops in Europe, I honestly don't think we need to move into Poland either; the Russians aren't a problem any more, other than as a rather weak but thuggish state. NATO is an artifact of the Cold War; it's time to end it completely, and to negotiate hospital rights using a new framework.

ShrinkWrapped,
The Israelis are in some sense the new Nazis. The Nazis used propaganda to dehumanize the Jews, to confiscate their property, to enslave them, and ultimately, after having used them completely, to confiscate their lives. The Israelis have been very successful at the first step, dehumanizing the Palestinians. I compare the way the Palestinians are acting to the way the Jews of Warsaw acted after they were herded into the ghetto; rage against the system. Given that it took the Jews just under two millenia to reclaim Jerusalem, and given that the Palestinians are culturally similar in obstinancy, I expect that we are seeing here only the first 50 years of about two millenia of struggle.

Poland sounds like an appropriate place to me.

We see these polls often, from every country around the world. I think possibly it has more to do with the perception of American power (and a belief that we will use it).....
I also think that the people who respond to these polls are defining world peace as an absence of military activity, a maintenance of the status quo; however inharmonious or oppressive it might be, it constitutes peace as long as American tanks aren't rolling in the streets." (Bennett)

You make salient points, Bennett. Another aspect often not made about polls or other indicators of public opinion in Germany is that those GErmans surveyed who had grown up in the former East Germany have been inculcated with a virulent anti Americanism. I doubt the new order has mitigated that dislike.
Former Chancellor Schroeder apparently made a lot of political hay out of this antipathy during his time in office.
One can still query, however, why Germany, at one time the economic leader of Europe, has not stepped up as the bold, realistic foreign affairs leader.
Some have watched with unease Germany's increasing economic partnership with her old nemesis, Russia (not at all the 'weak, thuggish state' one commenter cited.)

Uncle:

I generally agree with your posts but I cannot let your rather absurd notion of the Israelis as Nazis go unchallenged. The Palestinians are in a ghetto of their own choosing. They were not put there by the Israelis. Israel acquired most of the currently “occupied“territories from Jordan as a result of the Six Day War. Ben Gurion pleaded with King Hussein to stay out of the war as Israel had no intention of attacking Jordan since they had not allowed Palestinian terrorists to use Jordanian territory to attack Israel. For some irrational reason Jordan entered the war after Egypt and Syria had been defeated. Had they stay out Israel would not be in the West Bank today.

If anybody confined the Palestinians to the “Ghetto” it was their Arab brothers. Jordan kicked them out in 1970 and Egypt didn’t want them back when they signed a peace treaty with Israel. The Palestinian presence in Lebanon sparked the decade long Civil War which allowed Syria and Iran to take over the country. The Palestinians could have had their state which included East Jerusalem but they rejected the Wye River deal and started the infitada instead.

Nobody dehumanized the Palestinians except the Palestinians themselves.

Whatever the causes or legitimacy of these beliefs, they spell doom for American Hegemony.

Which is fine. We have evolved into the world's policeman and the world hates having a world policeman. The fact that it cannot police itself is utterly irrelevant.

I really don't think any amount of talk or "reeducation" is going to change this.

The Europeans are responding ultimately to fear (and it is NOT fear of America), and the belief that some sort of realignment away from America (the alliance with whom puts them in you-know-whose crosshairs) will only grow stronger.

I read an article recently about German attempts to protect nuclear reactors from terrorist attacks. It didn't say what sort of groups they're worred about, but I am pretty sure Focus on the Family is not one of them.

Whoa, big news, other countries hate us.

We have a large number of people who are so-called "Americans" who hate America as well - they're known as "Democrats".

Wish our Democrats were located OCONUS, like the Germans.

uncle,

I have to agree with jerry. The Israelis did not set out to murder the Palis, lock them away in camps, or anything of the sort. There are, after all, Arab members in the Israeli Knesset, so I think we can absolve Tel Aviv of having the same kind of ubermensch / untermensch mindset of the nazis. I strongly suspect that, if Arafat hadn't goaded his people into the suicidal (literally) intafada which led Israelis to hate and fear Palis and try to wall them off from Israel, then the two people would live together, if not with love, then at least in peace.

I believe this is easy. Let's just ask the German people about our presence their OFFICIALLY. Put it on a ballot and ask if US troops should remain. If that cannot be done, then a broad, scientific poll could suffice. Let's get it ON THE RECORD. If no, we leave. Forget the hearsay stuff, let's find out what they REALLY want.

If they don't want us there, we should leave. I'm tired of being a punching bag.

Uncle,
The Saudis are not friends of democracy by any means, and they know it.

I would be surprised if they were NOT interfering in Iraq. After all, they send billions worldwide to spread Wahhabism.

I remember hearing some Iraqis writing about how much they hated the Wahhabis. (I forget which Iraq blog.)

It is important for us to recruit the Iraqis before the Saudis do. The difference in recruitment technique gives us the advantage. The Wahhabis recruit through intimidation. We recruit by saying come join the government.

I have enough respect for ordinary Iraqis to believe that they can see this difference and act accordingly. But it is critical for us not to abandon them. That would be a deeply shameful act, and would mean that our friendship is worth nothing.

I am still looking for a Democrat other than Lieberman who understands that.

@ Dave on the subject of hijabs. Sir, you couldn't be more wrong. I was married to an Iranian, and his mother traveled back and forth to Iran, and she was always required to wear a CHADOR, which is a form of the burqa.

The rich woman may just wear hijabs, but polite society in Iran demands that they keep to their HOMES, where they can wear anything they wish, but in public they must wear a chador. The only difference between a chador and a burqa is that the chador doesn't cover the face.

Unless you've lived with Iranians, you don't know what you're talking about.

Theresa,
"as an American I think the pacifist bent of all the nations you list is more a threat to world peace than the US could ever be and history supports my assertion"

Very well said. Pacifism is a far bigger threat to peace than a "speak softly and carry a big stick" approach has ever been.

I'm with Larry J on this. I don't care how loved or not we are by the Germans and the rest of western Europe--time for them to provide for their own defense. They could be super grateful and pro-American, they could throw a party for us all annually, doesn't matter, we shouldn't be spending $$ to carry any of them any more. I'd much rather see us redeploy from old Europe than from Iraq. Further, as appalled as Washington would be at the thought of leaving Europe, I am positive it would be overwhelmingly endorsed by Americans of all political stripes. A great idea in search of a candidate . . .

Duches of Austin:
I guess all the photos I am shown by my coworker of Iranian women with simple scarves on, like in the link I gave, must be photoshopped. I told her she is a liar, and I showed her your post. She just laughed.

I know this woman well. I tend to trust her and her photos E-mailed to her from Iran over the Duches of Austin from Captains blog. Sorry.

Duches of Austin:
“I was married to an Iranian, and his mother traveled back and forth to Iran…”
“Why not just drop a nuke on Tehran? Why do we need boots on the ground in Iran? Why not another Hiroshima instead?”

Wow. I heard of not liking your in-laws, but you’re a little extreme!

“I've been smoking [marijuana] every day for over 30 years...”

I bet.

Great dave, which do you wear, the headscarve or the full burkha, y'know, just to keep it real?

I've quoted you and linked to you here: http://consul-at-arms.blogspot.com/2007/03/re-its-safer-to-hate-us.html

If most americans think we should get out of Germany (myself included) why the hell are we still there? Is it congress that keeps us there? The Pentagon? GWB? Theres no reason to be there. Who calls the shots to continue this policy? IMHO theres something hidden about why we remain there. It defies logic. Anybody got a clue?

As to the question of why we remain in Germany (or anywhere else in Europe), I can't claim to have the answer but it seems to me that given our worldwide commitments, we need bases somewhere besides the USA. Certainly, Landstuhl and Ramstein have seen plenty of activity since the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq started, activity that has nothing to do with Germany itself.

In addition, conventional wisdom has it that Germany is permanently pacified and will never again perceive the need for "lebensraum". Perhaps yes, perhaps no. Perhaps it's best if we never have to find out for sure by leaving Germany to her own devices.

Realigning US Forces from Germany is like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. It would accomplish nothing. Until such time NATO is unwound nothing will change. The US is still committed to protecting most of Europe therefore it does not matter a great deal where US forces are stationed.

What needs to be done is for the US to withdraw from NATO. NATO in its current state represents a security threat equal to that of the Islamic terrorists.

The lack of insight into america's foreign policy in the last 50 years is astounding.Reading these comments help validate the fact that the u.s is the biggest threat in the world.The belief that america has only bombed countries for liberty and no national self interest worrys me but explains alot.You are re-writing history.You didn't independanty 'trash' germany,you didn't do anything until pearl harbour,oh sorry you did you sold us supplies and equipment and you were neutral,for god sake the u.s didn;t even declare war against germany and japan they did. The marshall plan did help rebuild the u.k 's infrastucture because unlike america we had bombs land on us..But we had to pay for it,the u.k has only recently paid off the war debt .we have been paying it for 60 years. So other countries are ungrateful and jealous of the u.s.You have been had then over the years if you all believe that.The U.S has always been seen as a retarded child with a trust fund,ignorant of the world and blind belief in your greatest when the evidence shows the opposite.I pity you,if you all are a true example of americans prepare for a bleak future.

Millie

You seem like a Brit who has their knickers in a twist. Of course, I can understand why that might be given the current state of the UK and your hostages.

I suggest you get use to this new world order where there is no EU NATO or UN to protect you.

But remember cool britinia is still cool

joe, i hope i am not to late to catch you.'knickers in a twist' a bit patronising ,maybe it's my time of the month,women hey.You seem unaware that the majority in the u.k wishes to align ourselves with the eu nato and the un,anyone but the u.s.If you are all unaware of the distain and objection to the Bush regime by your closest allie then god help your blinkered land.Please do not 'help' our hostage crisis,your country has no skills to offer,our soldiers have more of a chance of being killed by american soldiers then the enemy.Your 'united' states are politically divided in the most immature un-sophisticated way.If there is any dialogue which expolres how the world see's america and can make well referenced debate without insults let me know.Knowledge is the greatest power,if you all remain so ill-informed you will be in a pepetual war,leading to rising american deaths.WAKE UP.

joe, i hope i am not to late to catch you.'knickers in a twist' a bit patronising ,maybe it's my time of the month,women hey.You seem unaware that the majority in the u.k wishes to align ourselves with the eu nato and the un,anyone but the u.s.If you are all unaware of the distain and objection to the Bush regime by your closest allie then god help your blinkered land.Please do not 'help' our hostage crisis,your country has no skills to offer,our soldiers have more of a chance of being killed by american soldiers then the enemy.Your 'united' states are politically divided in the most immature un-sophisticated way.If there is any dialogue which expolres how the world see's america and can make well referenced debate without insults let me know.Knowledge is the greatest power,if you all remain so ill-informed you will be in a pepetual war,leading to rising american deaths.WAKE UP.