Captain's Quarters -

Captain,

I applaud the Turkish Army for their stance,. They are fulfilling the basic mission assigned to them, to defend their Constitution. Our own military makes the same promise, and each and every officer and enlisted man swears to "Protect and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic".

Turkey's constitution mandates a secular government, and any attempts to impose a theocracy mest be vigorously opposed. It 's the same way here.

The Turks should be given every manner of support from our own nation if they ask for it, in order to keep Islam's hand off of the reins of power. It would be the same if the Pope or the Dali Lama demanded authority to impose religious rule.

respects,

A demonstration of choosing between the lesser of two evils.

On the one hand, a military coup and dictatorship is undesirable.

On the other, so is an islamist Turkey.

Best choice: military coup.

Hopefully, it won't happen.

While I reluctantly favor the military's position here, I think any claims that Turkey represents a successful Islamic democracy are mere wishful thinking. Given their own preferences, it seems the people would head straight towards the seventh century.

Hey, I'm in Istanbul and I've just come back, having tried to attend the rally in Istanbul today. The weather was good and the parents thought it would be risky, so off I went. And didn't make it any closer than 2 km from the main rally point due to the crowds.

So this is a second-hand account, via the Turkish press. The police reported one million in attendance. The BBC calls this, rather patronisingly, a demonstration by "the secular elite". Gosh. Never realised elites could be so large, nor that they all turned up at the meeting. :-P If 1 million fundies had turned up, would that have been termed "the fundamentalist elite"? :) Silly, really.

Quite a few women in headscarves too. Which is as I expected.

An interesting point about this meeting was that after the obligatory "Turkey is secular and will remain secular" slogans, the most popular was "Neither sharia nor coup". It seems that after eighty years of gestation, Turks have discovered the joy of expressive people power. :)

What is more interesting is that, of course, Turkey has become less religious over the past four years under this Islamicist government than it was before. What people are demonstrating against, I think, is not the fact that Turkey is inching towards religious rule - which I consider to be less likely than this occurring in the US (covertly) - but that most people are tired of the ruling AKP's kneejerk reaction that headscarves are good.

Anyway, it was fun and interesting although I couldn't attend. And I think the next one will be out of Istanbul, so I'll just have to follow that on TV. Looking forward to the Constitutional Court's ruling perhaps next week on the legality of the elections.

And then, some time this year, we'll have general elections. AKP will do well - they've been excellent on the economy and the EU - but I don't see them getting as large a block of seats in the Assembly this time round. And so the taming of the Turkish Islamists will continue.

BTW, Curmudgeon, your nickname is apt. :-P

Hey, I'm in Istanbul and I've just come back, having tried to attend the rally in Istanbul today. The weather was good and the parents thought it would be risky, so off I went. And didn't make it any closer than 2 km from the main rally point due to the crowds.

So this is a second-hand account, via the Turkish press. The police reported one million in attendance. The BBC calls this, rather patronisingly, a demonstration by "the secular elite". Gosh. Never realised elites could be so large, nor that they all turned up at the meeting. :-P If 1 million fundies had turned up, would that have been termed "the fundamentalist elite"? :) Silly, really.

Quite a few women in headscarves too. Which is as I expected.

An interesting point about this meeting was that after the obligatory "Turkey is secular and will remain secular" slogans, the most popular was "Neither sharia nor coup". It seems that after eighty years of gestation, Turks have discovered the joy of expressive people power. :)

What is more interesting is that, of course, Turkey has become less religious over the past four years under this Islamicist government than it was before. What people are demonstrating against, I think, is not the fact that Turkey is inching towards religious rule - which I consider to be less likely than this occurring in the US (covertly) - but that most people are tired of the ruling AKP's kneejerk reaction that headscarves are good.

Anyway, it was fun and interesting although I couldn't attend. And I think the next one will be out of Istanbul, so I'll just have to follow that on TV. Looking forward to the Constitutional Court's ruling perhaps next week on the legality of the elections.

And then, some time this year, we'll have general elections. AKP will do well - they've been excellent on the economy and the EU - but I don't see them getting as large a block of seats in the Assembly this time round. And so the taming of the Turkish Islamists will continue.

BTW, Curmudgeon, your nickname is apt. :-P

I lived in Turkey as a child (in Ankara, in the 50's) and later as an adult (in Sinop-- on the Black Sea --with the USAF, in the 70's). I experienced living under martial law both times. Believe me, a military coup is the best option, should push come to shove.

No. People don't march to democracy!

But in turkey, with the muslems attempting to take over the country; what you see now is a statement.

The military is secular.

And, if you want to walk around the turkish parliament, don't put in a man (Gul), whose wife is covered.

Again, it's that "relgious war" question. That pops up to reveal people hate being forced to accept the "religious doctrines" of political leaders.

We don't need to use our military in America; because the religious right is very marginalized.

Too bad for turkey it's gonna take guns.

Where is the secular Turks theological opposition to the rule of the imams based on Islam’s scared texts?

Where is the support of the Muslims in the West, with all the freedoms of the West, for the secular Turks demonstrations against the spread of Sharia in Turkey?

Where are the western elites providing support to the secular Turks demonstrating against the spread of Sharia in Turkey? Heck, where is the opposition to the spread of Sharia in the West from western elites?

Maybe when Maximum Leader Pelosi finishes breaking bread with the mad mullahs in Tehran she can stop in Istanbul and speak out in support of freedom of conscience for all men. I wont hold my breath. The American hating Left that rules us from congress aren’t to big on the Rights of Man hear at home.

What city do you think good Muslims will nuke first?

"Islamists believe in shari'a and the Qur'an teachings that make Islam the basic form of temporal government. It is a conflict that many Arab nations either have or will approach in the near future, but the Turks had thought this conflict settled long ago."

many arab nations? in reality it is every nation with a muslim population approaching 3-5%. radical islam has much in common with malignant cancer cells. the growth pattern is the same and in some sense the method is the same--terror. sharia does not avow itself to the ballot box. how the majority of turks feel is irrelevant. when the heads start rolling down the alleys, as they assuredly will, only a very brutal temporary police state that executes on sight the radicals will there be any chance of a secular state surviving. the process all but kills a nation. much like extreme kemo. you live but feel like dying.

strangely turkey has a much better chance of success compared to europe. turkey will crack down whereas europe, hamstrung by its legal code and inherent self hate will probably submit to dhimmitude.