Immigration Post-Mortem: CQ Nailed It
In the aftermath of the failure to get cloture on the immigration bill, many pundits suggested that the Republican caucus got cold feet after hearing from their constituents. Instead, I wrote that the compromise doomed itself to failure through a process that cheated legislators of access to crafting changes and generally arrogated power to a selected few Senators. (I went into greater detail on my CQ Radio show the previous day.)
Now, as The Corner reports, a memo circulating on Capitol Hill has confirmed my analysis:
There are three primary reasons the bill failed:* The complicated legislation, constantly being tweaked by the White House and Deal-Makers, is full of loopholes and problems that deserved amendment and full consideration -- consideration denied by the Democrats.
* The White House, certain Democrats and the Deal-Makers blatantly disregarded the legislative process -- drafting the bill behind closed doors, skipping the committee process, jamming the bill through the system, limiting the number and type of amendments that could be offered and trying to close down debate on the bill long before appropriate concerns with the bill had been addressed fully.
* The American people rightly refuse to buy what the Deal-Makers are selling -- the rewarding of legal status in our country to millions who ignored our laws in exchange for yet another promise to fix our broken immigration system.
The circular goes into detail about the specific complaints of the bill's opponents. None of them have as much to do with substance as with process. In fact, the two subject headings that detail the underlying complaints of the summary are "Important Republican Amendments Rejected, Ignored, or Undermined" and "A Failed, Anti-Democratic Process." As I warned last week:
The handful of Senators in the coalition never showed the bill to anyone prior to dumping it on the Senate and demanding that the committee process be bypassed and the debate schedule truncated. Even Harry Reid could not abide that kind of arrogance and extended the debate so that people could actually read the bill. The Senate then took on the role of Committee Of The Whole, but on such an accelerated rate that Reid had to ration the number of amendments. In the end, he didn't leave enough time for the bill to have its proper review, and it failed -- and quite properly.Regardless of the merits and demerits of the bill, this process was atrocious and arrogant. Had the bill come through committee as was proper, we wouldn't have had the parliamentary free-for-all we saw these last two weeks. It would have allowed for interested parties to carefully peruse the legislation, fix its myriad problems, and have an intelligent debate over amendments. Instead, we had the ridiculous fire drill of a nine-day scrum to determine the overhaul of our entire immigration and border security systems, starting in ignorance and ending in ignominy.
This is why the current bill will never make it back off the table. In order to get any more support from Republicans -- and they need 15 more votes -- the entire mess has to go through the normal legislative process. That will take weeks, perhaps even months, but it's the process that should have been used all along. That would have avoided the need for extensive debate and amendments in the last two weeks, and it would have removed the arrogance from the process.
In a development that underscores the death of the current bill, Saxby Chambliss and Johnny Isaacson appear to have defected from the Grand Coalition, and now want a supplemental spending bill that focuses on border security:
We believe the way to build greater support for immigration reform in the United States Senate and among the American public is to regain the trust in the ability of the federal government to responsibly administer immigration programs and enforce immigration laws. There is bipartisan agreement that we need to secure our borders first, and we believe this approach will serve as a platform towards addressing the other issues surrounding immigration reform.To that end, we believe that you and your administration could alleviate many of the fears of our constituents by calling for an emergency supplemental bill to fully fund the border and interior security initiatives contained in legislation currently pending in the Senate, as well as any outstanding existing authorizations. Such a move would show your commitment to securing the border first and to stopping the flow of illegal immigrants and drugs into our nation. It will also work towards restoring the credibility of the federal government on this critical issue.
"Outstanding existing authorizations" means the 854 miles of border barriers authorized and funded by the last Congress. Build that, and we'll get back to you, Chambliss and Isaacson told the President in this statement.
UPDATE: I'm not saying that the grassroots efforts had no effect, and I would certainly encourage people to continue contacting their Senators to explain (politely) their opposition to the bill. Gary Gross even got a nice response from Norm Coleman by doing so. What I'm saying is that this bill had almost no chance of passing from the very beginning.
Posted by Ed Morrissey on June 12, 2007 10:58 AM | Comments (34) | TrackBacks (1)
Comments (34)
Posted by John Steele | June 12, 2007 11:40 AM
So, the voice of the people IS actually meaningless then. Figures. S
o much for our noble experiment in freedom --- our betters really do know better and we had all best just keep quiet and toe the line.
Posted by Mwalimu Daudi | June 12, 2007 11:43 AM
Thanks for the info, Captain!
Posted by Charlie | June 12, 2007 11:44 AM
Is it just me? Seems the ones who had the initiative to get here ignoring all laws and obstacles are the ones we want. The ones who wait in line and follow the procedures outlined by our Congress are not likely to make here.
How could you design a better sorting mechanism to get the most creative, enterprising types from around the world as future Americans?
Posted by NahnCee | June 12, 2007 11:46 AM
Bush having lunch with Republicans today to try to push for it. It's being described as a "win one for the Gipper" appeal. Given the analysis above, the objections of arrogance will not go away just because the White House wants to pile *more* arrogance on.
I tend to think, however, that the "arrogance" and procedural argument should not be stood up as a stand-alone reason. I have to believe that incumbent senators (Republicans *and* Democracts) have heard and know they will continue to hear an extremely loud drumbeat that if they force this legislation through they *will* be voted out toot sweet in the very next election ... if not impeached first.
If Bush and his lunch buddies decide to push for the fence the higher, the sooner, the better, it would be a win-win for everyone. If Bush wants to lay his job on the line pushing for the current DOA legislation, fine. It will put "paid" to his place in history, as well as to any further support he might have had for his plans for Iraq and the war on terror.
Posted by RBMN | June 12, 2007 11:51 AM
The parts least discussed, and most important to future security, are the design of the tamper-proof, forge-proof,, biometric identification system (Z-Visa) and its associated database. Because, once you have a database of millions of faces and fingerprints that you didn't have before, names and addresses you didn't have before, there are lots things you can do with it, as market researchers understand well. And for Homeland Security and the FBI, it would be a goldmine. A goldmine. That's what they throw away too. That's what I worry about.
Posted by unclesmrgol | June 12, 2007 12:04 PM
Power is "arrogated" already in both the Senate and the House to the Committees. Why are certain Committees such "plum" assignments? Answer: Huge barrels of pork.
The fence will never get built. Too many voters have citizenship on the other side of the border.
Posted by Adjoran | June 12, 2007 12:23 PM
I'm against this bill because it's a bad bill, but if you are going back to the position of building the fence BEFORE anything else is discussed, we'll get no bill at all - and no fence.
Nice going.
Posted by Realist | June 12, 2007 1:17 PM
So once again we see that process is more important than substance. We also see once again that the opinions of the citizens of this country mean little or nothing to our governing elite.
As I said earlier, the fix is in.
Viva la raza!
Viva la reconquista!
Viva El Presidente Jorge bin Jorge al-Bush!
Islam is a religion of peace!
Allahu akbar!
Posted by pa | June 12, 2007 1:45 PM
Please go read this extraordinary statement by Newt Gingrich RIGHT NOW:
http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=21091
Point 2 says:
"The Attempt to Blackmail the American People by Threatening to Refuse to Enforce the Law Without a New Bill Is Disgraceful: A number of powerful figures in the Bush Administration and in the Senate have been saying that if we do not agree to pass this destructive bill, they will never enforce the law. Tell your senator that this is an extraordinary effort to blackmail the American people by having officials state that they will fail to perform their sworn duty, and we won't stand for it."
Nice commentary at bizzyblog:
http://www.bizzyblog.com/2007/06/11/crossing-the-line-jumping-over-the-line-with-both-feet/
Posted by marinetbryant | June 12, 2007 2:28 PM
I'm kind of a nit picker, Captain, it's Isakson.
Tom
Posted by Bill Faith | June 12, 2007 2:31 PM
I linked from my 2006.06.12 "No Illegal Left Behind" Roundup. I don't so much care why the bill died, just so long as it stays dead. Harry Reid wants it to stay dead so he can blame it's death on George Bush and I'm upset enough with Bush over the whole thing that that suits me just fine.
Posted by Duke DeLand | June 12, 2007 2:35 PM
Even as I blog about the hopelessness of communicating with our less-than-worthless Senator Mel Martinez, I still have sent the email to his site which EACH & EVERY one of us needs to send to our Senators.....
BUILD THE FENCE 1st
Duke
Posted by horse | June 12, 2007 2:39 PM
Praise the Lord both Chambliss and Isaacson heard our voices. Being a legal GA resident I have written them several times with concerns, promises of carrots, and threats of sticks on this issue. Guess I may need to pay up soon, and am more than happy too if this thing is truly D-E-A-D dead!
I would like to think it was my comment if they thought Sherman's name was mud in GA, wait until they voted for that compromise bill supporting an even larger invading foreign army stealing jobs and benefits rather than chickens; but I imagine they probably didn't even see it.
To clarify, my p.o.v. is the GA senators said it correctly; we need to sequence these steps in the right order and prove we can significantly slow the flow of illegals before we can provide amnesty to those already here. Otherwise, we provide amnesty first and then get FLOODED with millions upon millions of more illegals. I am comfortable with amnesty and increasing LEGAL immigration for those who meet/don't fail certain requirements in a few years, once we have proven we can control and secure our borders and ports of entry. Anything less will be a path to anarchy and eventual violence.
Posted by RG | June 12, 2007 2:54 PM
Captain - the third reason was the voice of the people, why discount that?
See Howard Fineman's column on MSNBC today...surprising coming from him. He sums up Jorge Arbusto quite well and ends his column with the quesiton: "Do border mean anything?"
From National Review Online today...
"To begin with Mexicans, who are the largest number by far, a huge majority are unskilled, many illiterate, and, considering the last decade’s shif in their geographical origin southward, from the central states to Chiapas and Oaxaca, many are speaking poor Spanish and are illiterate in that language as well. To pretend that we could assimilate them when Mexico failed to do so in centuries is delusional. All this without even mentioning the fact that, from primary school on children in Mexico are indoctrinated in hostility to the United States (the greenback excepted). "
Posted by BoWowBoy | June 12, 2007 2:55 PM
Captain, my Captain ............el Capi-tan ............if you believe the main problem with the bill is that ....."the specific complaints of the bill's opponents. None of them have as much to do with substance as with process" ...............is true ....I think you have missed the boat.
I don't believe this to be the case at all .........but ..........If this is the case ...........myself and other opponents of the legislation better watch our Senators very closely over the next few weeks.
This whole bill ........ SB 1348 Amnesty And Guestworker Full Employment Bill of 2007 is flawed. The ten most important flaws as outlined by the Heritage Foundation are:
1) Grants amnesty for 12 to 20 million illegal aliens;
2) Creates a permanent temporary visa, the Z (for zeta's) visa;
3) Background checks on illegal aliens are limited to just 24 hours before automatic approval;
4) Illegal alien fugitives who have ignored deportation notices will now be extended amnesty;
5) Effectively Shuts down the immigration court system;
6) Transforms the Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency (ICE) from a law enforcement agency to an amnesty distribution center;
7) Gang members who illegally entered the USA will be extended amnesty;
8) Tuition subsidies in every state for illegal aliens;
9) Tax payer funded lawyers for illegal aliens;
10) Section 1(a) allows provisional Z visas immediately upon enactment, before border security measures are in place.
And you think the process is what killed the bill .........?????
Posted by RBMN | June 12, 2007 4:07 PM
Re: BoWowBoy at June 12, 2007 2:55 PM
Here's a question for you:
If you steal a credit card (I know you wouldn't really, but humor me) with a $30,000 limit that expires in June of 2008, would you expect to be able to use that credit card to spend a few thousand per month until June 2008, until Dec 2007, or for about 30 minutes from now? Probably in about thirty minutes from now it will be totally worthless. The 24 hours for the Z-Visa doesn't matter that much. When new information comes to light, the Z-Visa can be made worthless by entering a few computer keystrokes. It's valid till it's not valid, and it can be made invalid at any time. The card's validity comes from its checked status in the database. Not from its appearance.
Posted by Norm | June 12, 2007 4:30 PM
I'm with BowowBoy. It's not the process, it's the substance. All of the substance.
I want the FENCE FIRST. Captain, as much as I agree with nearly all of your comments, and have enjoyed your clear headed reasoning on many points, I have sensed for some time now that you are at odds with MOST of your readers who actually do go ahead and post comments here. Unfortunately, you appear soft on Securing Our Borders First.
Maybe after we eliminate the substance (which eliminates the bill), we can then talk about the process.
Thank you.
Posted by molonlabe28 | June 12, 2007 4:36 PM
The bill failed because the people do not want amnest and do not trust the same government which won't enforce existing laws to enforce new ones.
You want immigration reform?
Fine, let's start by:
1. Mining the border;
2. Putting a bounty on illegal aliens; and
3. Having Sheriff Joe Arpaio of Maricopa County Arizona house them in his Gitmo-like prison while they await extradition.
Next problem.
Posted by harleycon5 | June 12, 2007 4:39 PM
I agree that the very arrogance of the bill was part of what made it so unpalatable. However, one cannot discount the millions of angry reactions from the American people that sealed the deal. Believe me, this is not the first time a "cloak and dagger" bill has been thrown out but not stopped. We helped make it clear there was a political cost this time.
We must make it clear that the bribes and arm twisting should not make this bill any more palatable, as the President is trying to revive it. In that light, here are the Senators who are up for election, who you can email to make this clear:
* Alexander (R-TN)
Bennett (R-UT)
* Cochran (R-MS)
* Coleman (R-MN)
* Collins (R-ME)
* Cornyn (R-TX)
* Craig (R-ID)
* Domenici (R-NM)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hatch (R-UT)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Lott (R-MS)
* McConnell (R-KY)
Murkowski (R-AK)
* Smith (R-OR)
Snowe (R-ME)
Stevens (R-AK)
* Warner (R-VA)
(thanks to www.michellemalkin.com)
Start emailing!
Posted by BoWowBoy | June 12, 2007 4:40 PM
RBMN ...............your hypothetical analogy lacks reality .....but .....(let me humor you)........let me answer your question ......with a realistic question.
If you have a lottery or a contest provided by a company ......and on the ticket it says explicitly .......that you have to be an "American Citizen" .....to qualify as a winner of the contest or lottery. Who in there right mind ......would ever believe that if a person who won the contest .......was not an "American Citizen" ...that they could by means outside of the contest rules .....claim the grand prize ..........??
Posted by Fight4TheRight | June 12, 2007 5:21 PM
Hmmm....it appears some are overdue for some "U.S. Government 101" ! : )
First off, CQ DID nail this ...right on the head! This Immigration Bill died (so far) NOT because of the grass roots or people hollering, it died because enough of these prima dona politicians were "affronted" by the closed door dealings and limits on discussion.
Back to Govt 101. These Senators (and Reps for that matter) put their views and positions on display at election time and if they win, they firmly believe that they were chosen for what they believe in and once they get to Washington, it's time for them to perform. They "know" they are smarter than us lowly constituents and all they needed was the votes to gain the seat. Once they are in, they COULD CARE LESS what the majority of their base thinks or feels.
Teddy Kennedy, John McCain and Lindsey Graham pissed some Senators off royally with the clandestine approach to this bill and that is what doomed it. So congrats Captain Ed for reminding us what really drives votes in the Senate.
Posted by Fight4TheRight | June 12, 2007 5:23 PM
Hmmm....it appears some are overdue for some "U.S. Government 101" ! : )
First off, CQ DID nail this ...right on the head! This Immigration Bill died (so far) NOT because of the grass roots or people hollering, it died because enough of these prima dona politicians were "affronted" by the closed door dealings and limits on discussion.
Back to Govt 101. These Senators (and Reps for that matter) put their views and positions on display at election time and if they win, they firmly believe that they were chosen for what they believe in and once they get to Washington, it's time for them to perform. They "know" they are smarter than us lowly constituents and all they needed was the votes to gain the seat. Once they are in, they COULD CARE LESS what the majority of their base thinks or feels.
Teddy Kennedy, John McCain and Lindsey Graham pissed some Senators off royally with the clandestine approach to this bill and that is what doomed it. So congrats Captain Ed for reminding us what really drives votes in the Senate.
Posted by poodlemom | June 12, 2007 5:27 PM
Those of you who think this bill is DOA for now; guess again. Brit's show tonight included a clip of the attendees of today's "working lunch". Mitch McConnell says the feeling is the bill is 85% complete and with a few more amendments should be approved by July 4th.
These morons are totally tone deaf; they still don't realize that we do not BELIEVE them and we do not TRUST them!!
Bush is still stating that without this bill we have no chance to correct immigration problems. I am so furious with this man I could strangle him. He and the government has had 5 3/4 yrs since 9/11 to do something about immigration and we've seen no measurable change, or even an effort to do so.
A question though; how can we contact all the members of the list from Michelle's site? If I understand the process correctly; if you try to contact using the House/Senate web sites, your email will bounce (or be ignored) if it does not contain an address or zip code that corresponds with their districts
Posted by Laddy | June 12, 2007 5:32 PM
I'm the only Pub/conservative in the family and everyone, and I mean everyone, was opposed to this bill. This is the first time everyone in my family bothered to contact the Reps and Sens about any bill. Unfortunately we live in the Peoples Republic of Illinois so the Obamamessiah and Turbin Durbin are lost causes and will vote eventually for any amnesty bill.
Posted by poodlemom | June 12, 2007 5:32 PM
Those of you who think this bill is DOA for now; guess again. Brit's show tonight included a clip of the attendees of today's "working lunch". Mitch McConnell says the feeling is the bill is 85% complete and with a few more amendments should be approved by July 4th.
These morons are totally tone deaf; they still don't realize that we do not BELIEVE them and we do not TRUST them!!
Bush is still stating that without this bill we have no chance to correct immigration problems. I am so furious with this man I could strangle him. He and the government has had 5 3/4 yrs since 9/11 to do something about immigration and we've seen no measurable change, or even an effort to do so.
A question though; how can we contact all the members of the list from Michelle's site? If I understand the process correctly; if you try to contact using the House/Senate web sites, your email will bounce (or be ignored) if it does not contain an address or zip code that corresponds with their districts
Posted by RBMN | June 12, 2007 6:03 PM
Re: BoWowBoy at June 12, 2007 4:40 PM
My analogy was a good one. Yours is not. What it says on the physical card doesn't matter. Only what the government database says about the card (when the card is used) matters--just like your credit card.
Posted by AnonymousDrivel | June 12, 2007 6:32 PM
RE: poodlemom (June 12, 2007 5:27 PM)
A question though; how can we contact all the members of the list from Michelle's site? ...your email will bounce (or be ignored) if it does not contain an address or zip code that corresponds with their districts
If you have the time, phone the offices instead. That sends a more powerful message. Calling the Washington, DC offices is usually more difficult just because the waits are typically longer and the staff tends to just record your position. Extensive clarification is usually lacking. To get really substantial discussions to more receptive personnel, contact regional/home offices instead. Sometimes you can strike up an excellent repartee with the staff. If they are your local Congresspersons, they will listen quite intently. They may or may not agree with you, but you will get infinitely better responses, even if well rehearsed, and they will talk to you. Some will even console you... of course, it could be an act, too.
Still, any communication is good. Calling is best.
Posted by BoWowBoy | June 12, 2007 8:03 PM
Poodlemom .....call the following number ...which is the Congressional switchboard in D.C. ......and ............... ask to be connected to the senator's office.
202-224-3121
Another way is to call the toll free number that the illegal alien supporters and the open border crowd set up. It is in Spanish ....but .....it is really simple to designate your senator from the district the telephone call is being made from. The numbers set up by the Mexican Amnesty Activists:
1-800-882-2005
then:
Press 1 when you hear a Spanish message,
then Press 1 again, and wait till someone answers.
Posted by BoWowBoy | June 12, 2007 9:36 PM
Senator First Name Last Name District Phone DC Phone
AK Senator Lisa A. Murkowski 907-271-3735 202-224-6665 AK
Senator Ted Stevens 907-271-5915 202-224-3004 AL Senator
Jeff Sessions 334-244-7017 202-224-4124 AL Senator Richard C.
Shelby 205-731-1384 202-224-5744 AZ Senator Jon L. Kyl 602-
840-1891 202-224-4521 AZ Senator John McCain 602-952-2410 202-
224-2235 CO Senator Wayne A. Allard 303-220-7414 202-224-
5941 FL Senator Mel Martinez 407-254-2573 202-224-3041 GA
Senator Saxby Chambliss 770-763-9090 202-224-3521 GA Senator
Johnny Isakson 770-661-0999 202-224-3643 IA Senator Charles
E. Grassley 515-288-1145 202-224-3744 ID Senator Larry Craig
208-342-7985 202-224-2752 ID Senator Michael D. Crapo 208-334-
1776 202-224-6142 IN Senator Richard G. Lugar 317-226-5555
202-224-4814 KS Senator Sam Brownback 316-264-8066 202-224-
6521 KS Senator Pat
Roberts 913-451-9343 202-224-4774 KY Senator Jim Bunning 800-
283-8983 202-224-4343 KY Senator Mitch McConnell 502-582-6304
202-224-2541 LA Senator David Vitter 504-589-2753 202-224-
4623 ME Senator Susan M. Collins 207-945-0417 202-224-2523
ME Senator Olympia J. Snowe 207-945-0432 202-224-5344 MN
Senator Norm Coleman 651-645-0323 202-224-5641 MO Senator
Christopher S. Bond 573-634-2488 202-224-5721 MS Senator Thad
Cochran 601-965-4459 202-224-5054 MS Senator Trent Lott 601-
965-4644 202-224-6253 NC Senator Richard Burr 336-685-8916
202-224-3154 NC Senator Elizabeth Dole 919-856-4630 202-224-
6342 NE Senator Chuck Hagel 402-758-8981 202-224-4224 NH
Senator Judd Gregg 603-225-7115 202-224-3324 NH Senator John
E. Sununu 603-647-7500 202-224-2841 NM Senator Pete V.
Domenici 505-346-6791 202-224-6621 NV Senator John Ensign 702-
388-6605 202-224-6244
OH Senator George V. Voinovich 614-469-6697 202-224-3353 OK
Senator Thomas A. Coburn 405-231-4941 202-224-5754 OK Senator
James M. Inhofe 918-748-5111 202-224-4721 OR Senator Gordon
H. Smith 503-326-3386 202-224-3753 PA Senator Arlen Specter
215-597-7200 202-224-4254 SC Senator Jim DeMint 864-233-5366
202-224-6121 SC Senator Lindsey O. Graham 864-250-1417 202-224-
5972 SD Senator John Thune 605-334-9596 202-224-2321 TN
Senator Lamar Alexander 615-736-5129 202-224-4944 TN Senator
Bob Corker 865-637-4180 202-224-3344 TX Senator John Cornyn
972-239-1310 202-224-2934 TX Senator Kay Bailey Hutchison 214-
361-3500 202-224-5922 UT Senator Robert F. Bennett 801-524-
5933 202-224-5444 UT Senator Orrin G. Hatch 801-524-4380 202-
224-5251 VA Senator John Warner 804-739-0247 202-224-2023
WY Senator Michael B. Enzi 307-682-6268 202-224-3424
Posted by Scrapiron | June 12, 2007 11:44 PM
This bill is not and never has been an immigration bill, it is an Amnesty bill through and through. Maybe the president thinks he can gain enough Hispanic votes to offset the votes he has cost the congress in 08. Won't happen, Hispanics are like blacks, the democrats can cut off the head of their youngest child and they still vote democrat. Why is the mystery, the democrats have led the black population down a rosey path full of thorns for years and the blacks just smile and vote democrat. Could it be the welfare system the democrats have made and keep the black population dependant on? The only other answer is that the black population is really as stupid as the democrats think they are. They think the same about the Hispanic's and will buy them with welfare also.
Posted by OneCaGuy | June 13, 2007 12:23 AM
You are totally WRONG. If it was the process that was the reason for failure, why did people CHANGE THEIR MINDS ON THE BILL? Why is Chambliss now saying he wants a supplemental bill when he didn't before?
Your argument makes no sense; Chambliss was one of the ones who CRAFTED the back-room deal apart from the legislative process, why would he now be opposed to his OWN process??
You can say anything you want, GOP party leaders across the country were complaining the bill was SPLITTING THE GOP. Polls from Dems, Ind, AND GOP show NO SUPPORT for the bill.
And then there is the "shock" from GOP Senators and Bush that there would be so much outrage. Completely out of touch.
Bring the bill back, you will see even MORE outrage.
People just don't want amnesty, period.
Posted by ERNurse | June 13, 2007 7:00 AM
Captain Ed, I respectfully take exception to your use of the word "politely" in the context of dialogue with a member of Congress.
This Congress has clearly demonstrated that when it comes to voicing our concerns, polite conversation is meaningless and futile.
They don't listen to politely-voiced concern. They did, however, take note when we simply and firmly stated, "Look, you SOB: if you vote to give illegal immigrants priviliges that American citizens only dream about, your political career is toast and you'll have to move from your home town because you won't be welcome there anymore."
Have you learned nothing from the 2006 elections? The only sentence uttered by a citizen to which politicians take note is this: "If you... then your political career is toast."
Posted by Cousin Dave | June 13, 2007 8:49 AM
RBMN, the problem with that system is that the immigrant who wants to game the system only needs for the Z-visa card to be valid for one day. In one day's time, he can:
* Cross the border
* Get a Z-visa card
* Take the card to the courthouse and get a driver's license and a Social Security number
* Hire on at the chicken plant
Now he's safely in the system. IMS people can enter stuff into their computer all they want. It doesn't matter because his Z-card status will never be checked again. I don't think many people realize this, but most employers are prohibited by Federal law from asking applicants about their citizenship status as part of the hiring process. If the applicant presents credentials that appear to be valid, the employer is required to take them at face value. As long as the SSN comes up good, there is no way to check. Employers do not have access to the INS computer systems. The feds have an information wall between the INS system and the Social Security system; they are prohibited from cross-indexing SSNs to visas.
And it's not like the Z-card is going to be checked at the grocery store; that's where the credit card analogy breaks down. Once the illegal has obtained the driver's license and SSN and has acquired a job, the card's status will never be checked again.
Posted by Keemo | June 13, 2007 9:31 AM
The first request for membership dues (GOP) hit the trash can like a 90 mph fast ball; the second request was just sent back with these words printed on it: "shamnesty bill = no money, not now - not ever".. "I don't trust you; all talk and no action"...
I owned & operated a small business outside of Los Angeles for the past 25 years; commercial plumbing contractor. I have watched "first hand" the effects of illegal immigration in and around my community, as well as within my industry (building industry). My competition would show up on sites with truck loads of "day labor", picked up at the local 7/11 or gas station; they would pay these guys 100 dollars a day "cash" with no overhead attached (comp., payroll taxes; liability).. I ran a 100% legal business, with an apprenticeship program and a path to Journeyman status; benefits. Over the last 7-8 years, I had to slash everything in order to get contracts and stay alive.
How is this "helping American businesses"? How is this "improving American jobs"? How is this "adding to the tax structure"?
Pure 100% bullshit! Pandering to get votes at the expense of country; plain & simple. Shame on these idiots! Shame on Jorge Busho! Shame on all politicians! Bravo to the American public for shouting out "we won't take it any more".